Multiple Nexway/Kaspersky UK/KTS & VPN Subscription Renewal Issues

[Vaj]

We have run Kaspersky Total Security and VPN on Windows 10 for many years and have been very happy with the products and the quality of technical support.

The situation in respect of Nexway/Kaspersky UK/subscription renewals seems however to have changed radically for the worse since last year.

Can anybody suggest a way around the following issues please? We'd like to continue with Kaspersky but will not do so at any cost...

We have previously been stiffed by the UK/French company for a huge auto-renewal renewal cost for Kaspersky Total Security which support sorted out - they applied an ~ 50% discount and credited us with the difference. Our understanding was that all auto-renewal permissions were rescinded at that time as requested.

Despite this we a few weeks ago discovered that the VPN subscription was auto-renewed by Nexway/Kaspersky UK in late June while we were ill at more than double the cost of the previous year.

Trying to renew the Kasperksy Total Security subscription today we're finding that all options except UK/Nexway or other local agents are blocked. That the cost from Nexway/Kaspersky UK has again more than doubled, that the option to delete a credit card from the account is disabled/greyed out, and that the dialogue box forces explicit acceptance of auto-renewal and at whatever price the company feels like charging!!!

The geopolitical situation may provide some sort of feeble excuse for a price increase, but the measures adopted to force auto renewals at whatever price the company decides to magic up is utterly unacceptable and amounts to sharp practice.

We've taken the matter up with support, but have not had a reply yet. Nor do we know whether support is as before - it may well by now be controlled from Nexway France/Kaspersky UK.

We're not however going to accept yet another attempt by a business to use the power of a web platform to bludgeon the customer into signing up to utterly acceptable conditions. Even if the auto-renew and credit card issues are resolved may depending on the market refuse the sort of price increases sought too....

[Berny]

@Vaj Welcome.

This community can not assist you in this issue,  do you have a Kaspersky Technical Support INC number ?

[Vaj]

That's not very likely - that the community cannot assist. I asked support to help earlier today, so of course I have an INC number. There's been no answer as of yet.

A solution has been found for the benefit of those interested.

There may be other options, but it's possible to buy a 1 year x3 devices subscription from Amazon UK for £13.99 (about €17.04 tonight) and from Amazon.de for €31.95.

The Amazon order confirmation includes the required activation code, clicking on the days remaining link at the bottom RHS corner of the Kaspersky Total Security application window opens a page where you can with no requirement to directly involve Kaspersky.co.uk directly paste in the new activation code to kick in at the end of the current subscription.

I bought a subscription from Amazon.de because of the risk of post Brexit hassles via Amazon UK (I'm in Ireland) but even so their €31.95 is a long way removed from the highly opportunistic €57.99 that Kaspersky.co.uk are asking via the renewal link that comes up on the application and is offered on their website. That's before considering their forced requirement to accept auto renewal to complete the transaction on the website.

The disgraceful part is that they are discounting the same product by 60% to €23.19 if you dig it up on their website as a first time purchaser.

THIS IS NO WAY TO TREAT A 6 YEAR CUSTOMER!!

There's a lot that's not complimentary that can be said about practices like this - most will no doubt fill in the words for themselves...

 

[Vaj]

A quick check just now confirms that the pricing etc situation regarding VPN/Secure Connection Premium renewals and/or purchases is very similar to the above described regarding Kaspersky Total Security.

Best not to use the renew links, and to not permit an auto renew to go through...

[Flood and Flood's wife]

10 hours ago, Vaj said:

Multiple Nexway/Kaspersky UK/KTS & VPN Subscription Renewal Issues

• We have previously been stiffed by the UK/French company for a huge auto-renewal renewal cost for Kaspersky Total Security which support sorted out - they applied an ~ 50% discount and credited us with the difference. Our understanding was that all auto-renewal permissions were rescinded at that time as requested.
• Despite this we a few weeks ago discovered that the VPN subscription was auto-renewed by Nexway/Kaspersky UK in late June while we were ill at more than double the cost of the previous year.
• Trying to renew the Kaspersky Total Security subscription today we're finding that all options except UK/Nexway or other local agents are blocked. That the cost from Nexway/Kaspersky UK has again more than doubled, that the option to delete a credit card from the account is disabled/greyed out, and that 3. dialogue box forces explicit acceptance of auto-renewal and at whatever price the company feels like charging!
• We've taken the matter up with support, but have not had a reply yet. 
• The disgraceful part is that Kaspersky are discounting the same product by 60% to €23.19 if you dig it up on their website as a first time purchaser.
• THIS IS NO WAY TO TREAT A 6 YEAR CUSTOMER!!

• A quick check just now confirms that the pricing etc situation regarding VPN/Secure Connection Premium renewals and/or purchases is very similar to the above described regarding Kaspersky Total Security.

  Best not to use the renew links, and to not permit an auto renew to go through...

 

Hello @Vaj, 

We've edited some of your posts, only because our reply is relatively specific.

We agree with everything you've written, the topic has been & will (ioo), continue to be raised in the Kaspersky Community because the issues have not been addressed by Kaspersky. 

Kaspersky does not *reward* Kaspersky customer loyalty, sad but true. 

On the Kaspersky purchase page, Auto-Renewal, can be turned OFF, it's not *obvious*; select Details, in the popup, select No & Save - see image

Spoiler

IF the Auto-Renewal Plan management is not available in: https://shop.kaspersky.co.uk/enduser-portal/, it may be because Kaspersky support *previously* made changes, but not all the changes you specified?

Renewal subscriptions are subject to: "Your subscription starts the day of purchase ."

IF the software is not *installed* on the day of purchase, the days used countdown starts irrespective. 

Regarding the cost of renewal, compared to new, Kaspersky cover this with a little Subscription disclaimer: "Subscription Summary: Renewal prices are subject to change. Additional online offers & discounts may be available to new license purchases or customers that manually renew their licenses at the time of your renewal which are not applicable to your subscription."

(ioe), we've never been offered an online offer or discount that's even marginally comparative to the discounted *new* price - bah humbug Kaspersky?

Support may take 24 to 48 hours to reply, if the issue is complex, the response time may be longer. 

IF you have time, when support provide their advice, please share it with the Community? 

Thank you?

Flood?+?

Edited August 14, 2022 by Flood and Flood's wife

[Berny]

16 hours ago, Vaj said:

Trying to renew the Kasperksy Total Security subscription today we're finding that all options except UK/Nexway or other local agents are blocked. That the cost from Nexway/Kaspersky UK has again more than doubled ...

Clarification on my post above :  This Community cannot roll back this transaction.

[Vaj]

Thank you B and F&F for the replies.

I wasn't asking the community to roll back the VPN auto renewal B, only whether this was possible, and whether or not anybody knew a way around the huge price being charged for VPN and KTS by Nexway/Kaspersky UK via auto renewal. The Amazon options subsequently discovered and listed above turned out to be one way to circumvent the prices. I also asked whether there was a fix which would stop auto renewal and allow the removal of a credit card from an account.

Double checking this morning VPN/Secure Connection (wish they would call it one or the other – it’s confusing) is offered on the Nexway/Kaspersky UK website to first time buyers at the same €62.50 as they charged for our auto renewal back in July. I thought it was as KTS discounted for first timers…

Does anybody know if this price has been changed/the discount removed since 8th July 2022, or even whether or not the site could be recognising me as an auto renew customer and displaying a different price?

VPN/Secure Connection is not currently listed on Amazon UK, but IS offered on Amazon.de at €24.95 for 1 year x 5 devices...

Thank you for the information F&F on how to change/cancel auto renewals via the listed portal - that looks promising. The Auto Renewal Plan Management link is showing, but the page won't accept my log in even after resetting the password. Another for support...

Support replied this morning with a bland sorry for the inconvenience while quietly ignoring our complaint and request for a refund and method of removing a credit card. They despite their having been explicitly contacted on these matters (for heaven’s sake!!) want me to confirm that I want to stop auto renewal!!

The entire auto renewals edifice is a contrived one and is entirely of their making – one which is not easily circumvented. It's so far cost us of the order of €35 and more than half a day of our time..

Returning to the matter of Nexway/Kaspersky UK’s handling of renewals for existing customers:

It’s for the company to decide a selling price, but the setting up of the renewals system to very clearly guide existing KTS customers into paying an inflated price versus first timers and to de-facto bounce them into signing up to auto renewals at a price which the company is free to determine is another matter entirely. As is greying out the option to remove a credit card from an account.

Auto renewal seems reasonable and would be a convenience IF it was not subject to e.g. the doubling of the price for VPN/Secure Connection which we were stuck with.

There as F&F above seem to be less than obvious ways around it, but a repeat customer is entitled to assume that they will be/are being made a good faith renewal offer. They for this reason are unlikely to even think of searching for an obscure alternative.

What about the e.g. elderly customer that isn't up to speed on these possibilities?

We find it difficult to view this sort of practice as other than amounting to a serious breach of trust – especially since renewing customers are demonstrating considerable trust by continuing to use the product in the current geopolitical environment.

We also struggle to see it as being anything other than another case of the abuse of the power of web platforms which is becoming more and more prevalent these days.

It anyway surely amounts to playing with fire/eating the seed corn? This of course all comes before even thinking of the legal/consumer law ramifications...

Most fundamentally of all for us it runs diametrically opposed to the straightforwardness and refreshing integrity of products and service demonstrated over the years by Kaspersky in comparison with most of their Western competitors…

Edited August 14, 2022 by Vaj
typos

[Berny]

@Vaj You are welcome.

If this procedure doesn't work Kaspersky Tech Support is your only option.
Choosing for an authorized reseller is a personal choice.

[Vaj]

Thanks Berny.

 

[Flood and Flood's wife]

12 hours ago, Vaj said:

1. Thank you for the information F&F on how to change/cancel auto renewals via the listed portal - that looks promising. The Auto Renewal Plan Management link is showing, but the page won't accept my log in even after resetting the password.

Hello @Vaj, 

Thank you for posting back & the additional commentary. 

We happen to agree with you!

1. The the Nexway *user* login, is *not* the same as what you use for logging into (your) MyKaspersky account.

• IF you have time, when support provide their advice, please share it with the Community? 

Thank you?

Flood?+?

Edited August 15, 2022 by Flood and Flood's wife

[Flood and Flood's wife]

Sorry about the duplicated "The the ..." @Vaj; if you have the original Nexway email, when you originally purchased the software, you may find your Nexway username; in our case it's our normal name, not an email address... ?

Anyway, Kaspersky support will sort that for you as well, if necessary. 

Thank you?

Flood?+?

[Vaj]

Thanks F&F. I've been on other stuff for the past few days, but will look at this properly late tonight or tomorrow afternoon and will reply.

[Vaj]

Just to say that as of tonight Kaspersky.com support replied to a pretty formal complaint regarding our view that the Kaspersky.co.uk auto renewals process is unfair.

They said that they were cancelling the auto renewed VPN/Secure Connection subscription and refunding the full cost - and leaving the option open to restart the subscription at any time.

We asked for a refund of the difference between the auto-renewal and open market prices, but this at least definitively moves us into a situation where we can return to the market (probably Amazon.de) and buy at a more reasonable price and without auto renewal and related complications.

The company defends its position by saying that the first time price is heavily discounted and that the renewal price is the 'actual price'.

To be clear on the situation. We are happy with the product and the service (have been Kaspersky sutomers for 6 years now), we're even clear that it's for the company to decide the selling price.

We might well even pay the higher price if it was the option available...

The problem arose from the manner in which the system de-facto forced acceptance by the customer of the auto renewal option and as it turned out a year later all that it entails (from the perspective of the existing customer) in terms of disadvantageous pricing etc.

Which brings to mind another question :  ) .

Does anybody have any views on whether or not there are downsides to buying the product from a third party supplier like Amazon.de as we have already done in the case of Kaspersky Total Security?

It presumably is the same product and attracts the same support - and at minimum eliminates the auto renewal stuff - leaving it up to the customer to manually renew at the appropriate time?

Edited August 20, 2022 by Vaj
typo

[Flood and Flood's wife]

1 hour ago, Vaj said:

1. The company defends its position by saying that the first time price is heavily discounted and that the renewal price is the 'actual price'.
2. Does anybody have any views on whether or not there are downsides to buying the product from a third party supplier like Amazon.de as we have already done in the case of Kaspersky Total Security?
3. It presumably is the same product and attracts the same support - and at minimum eliminates the auto renewal stuff - leaving it up to the customer to manually renew at the appropriate time?

Hello @Vaj, 

Welcome back!

We're happy to read you've made some progress!

1. We've never heard the "first time price is heavily discounted... etc." argument from Kaspersky before?; what Kaspersky say in their product blurb is: "Renewal prices are subject to change. Additional online offers and discounts may be available to new license purchases or customers that manually renew their licenses at the time of your renewal which are not applicable to your subscription. We will send you at least one email reminder prior to renewal which will contain your renewal price and renewal term. You may be required to upgrade to the latest version of Kaspersky for free at this time."
2. Topic KSC vs KTS, by stephan1827, discusses Amazon.de. 
3. We know you will, but, read the specific product purchase terms & IF necessary, ask for information from Amazon.de & even Kaspersky, before purchase. 

Thank you?

Flood?+?

[Vaj]

Thanks F&F.

The term 'actual price' was used by a support person defending the auto renewal price.

I can't remember the details but there was a link to something like a terms and conditions document associated with renewal on the Kaspersky.co.uk website which if it is to be seen has to be opened just before committing to buying there.

My blurry recollection is that as well as de-facto forcing acceptance of auto renewal (this part at least is up front) they in the document give themselves permission to determine the price at the next auto renewal.

This might seem relatively inncouous, but doubling the price versus the original purchase and versus other options available in the market at auto renewal most definitely is not.

It's self serving boiler plate anyway. The reality for the customer is surely that a fair renewal price is that for which the same product/proposition can be bought on the open market?

Legalities apart (it's for the company to decide the selling price, but it seems very possible that a strong case could be made under consumer law to the effect that the website is designed to unfairly bounce the customer into accepting onerous T&Cs ?) the entire deal is surely a recipte for p1**ing off and losing customers/is a case of a company eating its seed corn by destroying their good will.

Insult is added to injury by virtue of the fact that this is happening to customers demonstrating the trust required to keep on using the product in the current geopolitical environment.

Perhaps many just blindly permit the auto renew to run. Those that do find out a year later (as we did) that they have been bounced into paying double the market are to say the least not going be very happy. No amount of a** covering via fine print and by provision of obscure options to cancel is going to make much difference to this reality.

On buying from Amazon.de. This fairly clearly is in contractual terms going to leave Amazon responsible in the event of 'commercial' problems. (their support is very definitely not what it was some years ago - but they at least have a vested interest in looking after their customer) Kaspersky in this case presumably still manage the app and provide technical support as usual - which suggests that there should at least be no technical problems?

Edited August 21, 2022 by Vaj
typo

[Vaj]

Just to say that Kaspersky.com support seem perfectly happy regarding our purchase of VPN/Secure Connection and Total Security subscriptions as above from Amazon.de.

Amazon.de support also confirmed prior to our ordering that they could see no problems regarding a purchase from Ireland.

The Secure Connection listing on Amazon.de has a link to a list of countries which can buy from it - it includes Ireland and the UK although there is a reference below the list to the possibility of additional restrictions in some countries. No idea what these might be, perhaps e.g. Brexit is a factor...

The new KTS subscription activated automatically upon expiry of the old. (we entered the activation code some time ago)

VPN/SC reverted to the limited free version upon cancellation of the refunded Nexway/UK subscription today by support.

Nexway/Kaspersky UK agreed the refund of their x2 priced auto renewal (see above) a week ago and sent a message to say that the app was no longer working - but in practice the refund has not yet arrived (the 8 days is up tomorrow) and they did not cancel the subscription.

This last caused problems because while we could log the new VPN/SC subscription activation code on My Kaspersky it didn't take over - we had to ask support to sort the situation out first.

We as above are very unhappy regarding the handling of auto renewals by Nexway/Kaspersky UK - we're pleased to have been able to continue with Kaspersky given the excellent product and support but sorting these matters out has wasted an enormous amount of our time.

The refund from Nexway/UK will hopefully come through in the next day or two...